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	<title>Comments for Fierce, Freethinking Fatties</title>
	<atom:link href="http://fiercefatties.com/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://fiercefatties.com</link>
	<description>Home of the Nouveau-Bese</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:59:04 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Fly Swatter — by atchka</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/08/fly-swatter/#comment-12826</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[atchka]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:59:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6497#comment-12826</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tom,
I&#039;m still royally swamped this weekend (son is here), but what is the source for your 300k figure? In research, newer doesn&#039;t mean better.

Peace,
Shannon]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom,<br />
I&#8217;m still royally swamped this weekend (son is here), but what is the source for your 300k figure? In research, newer doesn&#8217;t mean better.</p>
<p>Peace,<br />
Shannon</p>
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		<title>Comment on Jeffrey M. Friedman is my fat science hero! by Razwell</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2010/09/17/jeffrey-m-friedman-is-my-fat-science-hero/#comment-12825</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Razwell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:30:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=2190#comment-12825</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great blog you have here and I am VERY  happy to see you choose reputable world renowned sources of information. This is VERY rare. Kudos to you !

The Internet is full of people who are clueless about obesity. They are seeling people their nonsense etc.


Take care,

Raz]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great blog you have here and I am VERY  happy to see you choose reputable world renowned sources of information. This is VERY rare. Kudos to you !</p>
<p>The Internet is full of people who are clueless about obesity. They are seeling people their nonsense etc.</p>
<p>Take care,</p>
<p>Raz</p>
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		<title>Comment on Jeffrey M. Friedman is my fat science hero! by Razwell</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2010/09/17/jeffrey-m-friedman-is-my-fat-science-hero/#comment-12824</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Razwell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:28:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=2190#comment-12824</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dr. Jeffery Friedman IS an absolutel genius.  I have the greatest respect for the man. Morboid obesity is hellishly complex and the unknowns are far greater than any known. The stigmatization of obese people si nto scientifically supported at all.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr. Jeffery Friedman IS an absolutel genius.  I have the greatest respect for the man. Morboid obesity is hellishly complex and the unknowns are far greater than any known. The stigmatization of obese people si nto scientifically supported at all.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Philosophy by Fattertainment</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/philosophy/#comment-12821</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fattertainment]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 11:35:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?page_id=17#comment-12821</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Can you please add my web site to this cause?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can you please add my web site to this cause?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Fly Swatter — by vesta44</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/08/fly-swatter/#comment-12819</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[vesta44]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 07:54:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6497#comment-12819</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tom - The problem with deaths reported as being from obesity is that anyone who dies while being obese is reported as having died of &quot;obesity&quot; regardless of whether they actually died of any disease correlated to obesity (and correlation is not causation). A fat person who dies of a heart attack is listed as a casualty of obesity, but a thin person who dies of a heart attack isn&#039;t listed as a casualty of marcidity (being thin). And the funny thing is, both the thin person and the fat person died of the same thing - a heart attack, caused by the same thing, heredity and poor nutrition/exercise habits. But it&#039;s the fat person who is vilified for it and the thin person who gets a pass, because &quot;everyone knows&quot; that &quot;thin = healthy&quot; and &quot;fat = unhealthy&quot; so the fat person brought it on himself and the thin person, well, it was just bad luck. So, those 300,000 deaths a year from obesity that you&#039;re talking about? How many of them are actually &lt;em&gt;caused&lt;/em&gt;, scientifically proven to be caused, from being fat alone? I&#039;m not talking about diseases correlated with being fat, I&#039;m talking dying just from being fat?
Because the picture the media paints of the &quot;obesity epidemic&quot; isn&#039;t of people in the 25 to 35 BMI category, which is the majority of fat people - the picture the media paints is of people like me, with a BMI over 50, who are less than 1/2 of 1% of the fat population. It&#039;s a scare tactic to make people who aren&#039;t fat fear those of us who are so they will be willing for the government to employ drastic measures to turn fat people into thin people. Problem with that is there is no safe, permanent way to do so.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom &#8211; The problem with deaths reported as being from obesity is that anyone who dies while being obese is reported as having died of &#8220;obesity&#8221; regardless of whether they actually died of any disease correlated to obesity (and correlation is not causation). A fat person who dies of a heart attack is listed as a casualty of obesity, but a thin person who dies of a heart attack isn&#8217;t listed as a casualty of marcidity (being thin). And the funny thing is, both the thin person and the fat person died of the same thing &#8211; a heart attack, caused by the same thing, heredity and poor nutrition/exercise habits. But it&#8217;s the fat person who is vilified for it and the thin person who gets a pass, because &#8220;everyone knows&#8221; that &#8220;thin = healthy&#8221; and &#8220;fat = unhealthy&#8221; so the fat person brought it on himself and the thin person, well, it was just bad luck. So, those 300,000 deaths a year from obesity that you&#8217;re talking about? How many of them are actually <em>caused</em>, scientifically proven to be caused, from being fat alone? I&#8217;m not talking about diseases correlated with being fat, I&#8217;m talking dying just from being fat?<br />
Because the picture the media paints of the &#8220;obesity epidemic&#8221; isn&#8217;t of people in the 25 to 35 BMI category, which is the majority of fat people &#8211; the picture the media paints is of people like me, with a BMI over 50, who are less than 1/2 of 1% of the fat population. It&#8217;s a scare tactic to make people who aren&#8217;t fat fear those of us who are so they will be willing for the government to employ drastic measures to turn fat people into thin people. Problem with that is there is no safe, permanent way to do so.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Fly Swatter — by Tom Anderson</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/08/fly-swatter/#comment-12805</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Anderson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 01:14:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6497#comment-12805</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Did she come out in support of the billboards?  And did she actually say &quot;the ends justifies the means?&quot;  Or just support some of the things that S4L is doing?  I don&#039;t support the billboards, but I do applaud that they are trying to do something (note: this is not an invitation for a 10 paragraph response; we&#039;ve already talked about this; you disagree, and that is fine); and no, I don&#039;t think the ends justifies the means.  It just doesn&#039;t sound like the words of a compassionate person.  Given how you&#039;ve manipulated data before, I wonder if you&#039;re not manipulating people&#039;s words, as well.  For example, here&#039;s a conversation you and I started on S4L&#039;s FB page before:

Shannon: &quot;Yeah, what&#039;s the big deal with eating disorders. I mean, it only kills approximately 10,000 adolescents each year and is the deadliest mental illness, but who cares if a few kids starve themselves.&quot;
Me: &quot;Shannon, yeah, what&#039;s the big deal with obesity? It only kills 300,000 people in the US every year. http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/topics/obesity/calltoaction/fact_consequences.htm.&quot;
Shannon: &quot;You&#039;re beginning to betray your ignorance on the subject. First of all, that figure is for obesity AND overweight. But, more importantly, those figures have been revised by the CDC. Now, obesity is correlated with 112,000 deaths, while overweight has a NEGATIVE mortality rate of 86,000, giving a net mortality rate of 26,000, which is the most accurate figure, and ones which the CDC now accepts: http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/r050615.htm&quot;
Me: &quot;Shannon, you&#039;re beginning to betray your poor research skills and number manipulation. Your &#039;most accurate figure&#039; that the CDC &#039;now accepts&#039; are from 2005. The figures I quoted are from 2011; the 300k is for obesity. But the fact that you will stand by your claim by arguing that it is somehow not a bad thing that 112,000 obese people die from weight-related issues every year, because there is a &quot;negative mortality rate&quot; for overweight people? Are you kidding? 112,000 obese people still die every year because of weight-issues. That&#039;s great the being overweight isn&#039;t as bad as we thought, but you can&#039;t simply subtract them.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did she come out in support of the billboards?  And did she actually say &#8220;the ends justifies the means?&#8221;  Or just support some of the things that S4L is doing?  I don&#8217;t support the billboards, but I do applaud that they are trying to do something (note: this is not an invitation for a 10 paragraph response; we&#8217;ve already talked about this; you disagree, and that is fine); and no, I don&#8217;t think the ends justifies the means.  It just doesn&#8217;t sound like the words of a compassionate person.  Given how you&#8217;ve manipulated data before, I wonder if you&#8217;re not manipulating people&#8217;s words, as well.  For example, here&#8217;s a conversation you and I started on S4L&#8217;s FB page before:</p>
<p>Shannon: &#8220;Yeah, what&#8217;s the big deal with eating disorders. I mean, it only kills approximately 10,000 adolescents each year and is the deadliest mental illness, but who cares if a few kids starve themselves.&#8221;<br />
Me: &#8220;Shannon, yeah, what&#8217;s the big deal with obesity? It only kills 300,000 people in the US every year. <a href="http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/topics/obesity/calltoaction/fact_consequences.htm." rel="nofollow">http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/topics/obesity/calltoaction/fact_consequences.htm.</a>&#8221;<br />
Shannon: &#8220;You&#8217;re beginning to betray your ignorance on the subject. First of all, that figure is for obesity AND overweight. But, more importantly, those figures have been revised by the CDC. Now, obesity is correlated with 112,000 deaths, while overweight has a NEGATIVE mortality rate of 86,000, giving a net mortality rate of 26,000, which is the most accurate figure, and ones which the CDC now accepts: <a href="http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/r050615.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/r050615.htm</a>&#8221;<br />
Me: &#8220;Shannon, you&#8217;re beginning to betray your poor research skills and number manipulation. Your &#8216;most accurate figure&#8217; that the CDC &#8216;now accepts&#8217; are from 2005. The figures I quoted are from 2011; the 300k is for obesity. But the fact that you will stand by your claim by arguing that it is somehow not a bad thing that 112,000 obese people die from weight-related issues every year, because there is a &#8220;negative mortality rate&#8221; for overweight people? Are you kidding? 112,000 obese people still die every year because of weight-issues. That&#8217;s great the being overweight isn&#8217;t as bad as we thought, but you can&#8217;t simply subtract them.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Fat Teenagers No More Depressed Than Thinner Peers by Gizem</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2011/04/27/fat-teenagers-no-more-depressed-than-thinner-peers/#comment-12790</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gizem]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 21:13:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=3939#comment-12790</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[, the only times I&#8217;ve rlaely felt depressed in my life where when I lived in Utah, so maybe there&#8217;s something to it&#8230;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>, the only times I&#8217;ve rlaely felt depressed in my life where when I lived in Utah, so maybe there&#8217;s something to it&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Fly Swatter — by Smokin' Deist</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/08/fly-swatter/#comment-12789</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Smokin' Deist]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 20:30:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6497#comment-12789</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Try watching Penn &amp; Teller&#039;s Bullshit! episode on organic foods as well as weight loss--those are a couple of pretty good episodes on the subject. Like how the organic growers do use pesticides, just some older and less safe ones than some of the modern ones as an example.

You body tries to maintain a certain balance or level for many different things. The point you body tries to maintain at for each of these different things is known as a set point. Perhaps your metabolism&#039;s current set point is what draws you to that weight. I&#039;m not as deep into the medical/biology as my wife and I&#039;m sure she&#039;d have a better answer. Genetics are a factor and perhaps all the hormones in our food are one of the culprits. (I know I spoke somewhat negatively on organic foods, but that does not mean our mainstream food supply does not need some fixing.)

I do agree that a healthy diet is important and that I do need to take my own advice in that matter.  I have also learned that even moderate exercise is a big help--even without any noticeable weight loss. If you were doing some extensive exercise you should also consider that muscle is denser than fat and if you were ending up building some muscle and losing  some volume of fat, your weight could still go up. BMI is pretty much junk science anyway.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Try watching Penn &amp; Teller&#8217;s Bullshit! episode on organic foods as well as weight loss&#8211;those are a couple of pretty good episodes on the subject. Like how the organic growers do use pesticides, just some older and less safe ones than some of the modern ones as an example.</p>
<p>You body tries to maintain a certain balance or level for many different things. The point you body tries to maintain at for each of these different things is known as a set point. Perhaps your metabolism&#8217;s current set point is what draws you to that weight. I&#8217;m not as deep into the medical/biology as my wife and I&#8217;m sure she&#8217;d have a better answer. Genetics are a factor and perhaps all the hormones in our food are one of the culprits. (I know I spoke somewhat negatively on organic foods, but that does not mean our mainstream food supply does not need some fixing.)</p>
<p>I do agree that a healthy diet is important and that I do need to take my own advice in that matter.  I have also learned that even moderate exercise is a big help&#8211;even without any noticeable weight loss. If you were doing some extensive exercise you should also consider that muscle is denser than fat and if you were ending up building some muscle and losing  some volume of fat, your weight could still go up. BMI is pretty much junk science anyway.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Welcome BBC Readers! by Tig</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/09/welcome-bbc-readers/#comment-12788</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tig]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 20:15:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6513#comment-12788</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Apologies if this question has already been asked, but why are there more fat people today than there were a few decades ago?  I embrace the concept that we are all different shapes and sizes, and no size or shape is wrong, but why are more of us bigger nowadays?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies if this question has already been asked, but why are there more fat people today than there were a few decades ago?  I embrace the concept that we are all different shapes and sizes, and no size or shape is wrong, but why are more of us bigger nowadays?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Fly Swatter — by Smokin' Deist</title>
		<link>http://fiercefatties.com/2012/02/08/fly-swatter/#comment-12785</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Smokin' Deist]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 20:13:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fiercefatties.com/?p=6497#comment-12785</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s amazing what you can learn in school. I&#039;d rather be fat and happy than thin and miserable anyway.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s amazing what you can learn in school. I&#8217;d rather be fat and happy than thin and miserable anyway.</p>
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