Feederism is a sexual fetish.
A couple weeks back over at Fat Lot of Good, Bri posted about her upset at a body positive blogger, Mia Freedman, because of a post about “gainer” Donna Simpson. Bri seemed to feel that the comments section of that post was encouraging an environment of fat hating.
At the time, I read through the post and the comments section and felt endless frustration because a key element of the discussion seemed to be missing. The woman they are talking about, Donna Simpson, is in a gainer/feeder relationship with her husband and those that subscribe to her website. The important point here…
…feederism is a sexual fetish.
In my opinion, fat rights and sexual rights are two separate issues. And the suggestion that feederism represents fat people is like saying foot fetishes represents people that have big feet.
While, politically, I support a sex positive perspective, I don’t have any problem with the Fat Acceptance Movement trying to distance itself from the fat fetish community.
“NAAFA draws a distinction between fat fetishism and fat admiration: NAAFA states that ‘a preference for a fat partner is as valid as any other preference based on physical characteristics’, but also condemns feederism as coercive. NAAFA advocating that people ‘celebrate the current weight of their partner as one aspect of the whole person’.” Wikipedia : ‘Fat Fetish, Relation to fat acceptance movement’
Personally, I’m one of those bleeding heart liberals. I don’t have much patience for the tone of disgust that comes out when people talk about sexual fetishes. But, on my very next breath, I have to say “get your facts straight.”
I object to the suggestion that my fat has something to do with my sexuality, when I am NOT into feederism. And I don’t think it’s right to say that 60% of the US population is into feederism, either.
Not because feederism is bad. But because that’s a misrepresentation. Maybe it’s just a me thing trying to be all fair and balanced. But the lack of nuance, in this particular case, just really bugged me.
I’ve never really read much about feederism, although I have done a lot of reading about BDSM. To me, it seems like feederism is sorta kinda maybe like that - the feeder is the dominant one in the relationship and the feedee is the submissive partner, eating to gain to please, while gaining some form of pleasure hirself. Where this analogy breaks down is that there are no safe words to stop when the feedee thinks things are going too far.
The thing is, the hate expressed in those comments on that post is very real, and the people expressing that hate blindly see all fat people as being just like feedees - constantly eating and doing nothing, just so they can get fatter and fatter. Feedees are a minute proportion of the fat population, but are seen as representative of all of us.
Where I had a problem with Mia Freedman’s post is that it seemed more voyeuristic and exploiting than informational and balanced. The way she wrote it invited people to comment obnoxiously and they obliged. The ones who commented thoughtfully seemed to be shouted down or ridiculed or called “too sensitive”. I don’t know, it was more than a tempest in a teapot, that’s for sure.
vesta44 -
I think part of why I wanted to post about this is becasue from Mia Freedman to the commenters to the FAers, the discussion seemed really uninformed. Based on peoples assumptions and feelings.
I didn’t delve deep into research about Feederism…but I did wiki both Fat Fetishism and Donna Simpson. I wanted to post something about the topic that tried to be “informational and balanced.” Because I value those things.
I’m Catholic, so I come from a background where the authority feels justified in dictating sexual laws for us to follow. So, I’m naturally resistant to label any sexual activity as “bad” or “deviant.” From my experience, everybody has some little idiosyncrasy that flavors their sexuality. Your example of BDSM, for instance… a person can be into bondage just a little or they can be into it WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY over the top, to where they are endangering lives. So, as to the fetish itself, so long as both people involved are consenting adults and nobody’s life is endangered, then I’m all for it.
As far as people conflating feederism with Fat Acceptance… well, that’s just going to happen. People want to demonize fat people and, even moreso, Fat Acceptance. We’re considered deviants just for entertaining the idea that obesity is not the doomsday disease it’s made out to be. There’s nothing we can do to stop people from making asinine assumptions. All we can do is keep educating.
Peace,
Shannon
atchka -
As far as people conflating feederism with Fat Acceptance… well, that’s just going to happen.
It’s true. You almost have to expect that from the general public.
I’m hoping that for most people in our community this is just repeating information. But, if it isn’t, it’s a good point to clarify.
Hi
You know that Fat Acceptance once had a far closer relationship with Fat Fetishes. NAAFA’s website once was run off of Dimensions Magazine Online’s Servers. People on the NAAFA website used both websites as extensions of each other.
I think that it was a great day when new management at NAAFA changed the direction that the organization was headed. The discrediting of the Fat Fetish community is of minor importance compared to the welfare of the Fat/Size Acceptance community.
William
William -
I was aware of at least some part of that. I’ve been slowly compiling bits and pieces about FA history, so I’d read about NAAFA having roots with fat admiration but I wasn’t entirely sure if that included Feederism.
Thanks for the comment!
I would have to disagree with that. I believe there is room for both the fat fetish and the fat acceptance movement. If the fat acceptance movement tries to discredit the fat fetish movement, are we not, then, trying to do the same thing to them as the general population is doing to us?
“You don’t have any place with me because you are sick!” Is that not what the general population says about fatties in general? Whether it’s sick in body or sick in the mind or sick perverted. It’s the same thing.
I do not believe the fat acceptance movement should use the tactics of the ‘oppressor’ with other minority groups.
Besides, one can adopt a “live and let live” philosophy. Just because I don’t agree with somebody else, that doesn’t mean I have to discredit them. Just because I choose not to associate with somebody doesn’t mean I have to vilify them.
Just to clarify, what we were objecting to (and you have to remember that Mia’s original post was very different to the heavily edited version you can see today) was Mia’s tone about fat people. The feederism is another whole subject in itself that deserves focus on it’s own.
Mia originally created a very “point and stare” piece about fat people with reference to Donna Simpson, however she had references to non-feeders in her heading, several sentences and the photo of four fat women in swimsuits she chose as the accompanying shot. These were later edited out. She also changed the layout of her blog so that several body shaming posts were buried and supposedly “fat friendly” ones put to prominent positions, but only did so after the Australian media picked up on the subject.
This is not the first time Mia has done this, or that she has been called out on it, and it DOES create a measure of fat loathing in her comments, which are mostly left unmoderated unless they challenge Mia directly, or someone complains about them (but only if Mia feels like it).
Feederism and fat sexuality wasn’t the point that was being made - and yes, very much deserves discussion on it’s own merit.
sleepydumpling -
I understand that. I supposing that I saw the edited version of her post, which was focusing in on feederism. I’m not trying to say that calling her out was wrong, just that arguments like these can get really muddy.
My style of Fat Acceptance argument is let’s build a clear case becasue the other side is going to play dirty. I’m not as good with getting in the mud to defend our cause becasue I feel like I loose my footing. Which is why I didn’t participate in the comments of Mia’s post.
I’ve thought about this opinion in other circumstances and I thought Bri’s post was a great chance to bring it up.
Maybe MY post came off as a little defensive becasue I felt like if I even MENTIONED feederism and FA in the same place, I was worried I’d get attacked. Which is not fair becasue everyone here has been really great in comments.
sleepydumpling,
Next time, get a screep cap! The worst part about the internet is that you can edit things after the fact, which, many times, is enough to exonerate bigotry and hatred. I wish someone had the old version so we could compare and contrast. Oh well…
Peace,
Shannon
Unfortunately Shannon, we had no idea it was going to go where it went. And we never dreamed that the sneaky editing would happen until it did.
But next time, fo sho!
Elizabeth - I agree that an informational and balanced post about feederism is a good thing. I don’t have a problem with what other people do with their bodies, for the most part. If they’re into BDSM, go for it (been there done that, it was fun for a while). If they’re into feederism, well, not my place to tell them they can’t do that even if I don’t understand why they would want to do that (just like I don’t understand skydiving - why jump out of a perfectly functioning plane, for crying out loud). Same goes for body modification - I’ve seen people who have had horns surgically embedded in their skulls, their bodies tattooed like leopards, etc. Whatever floats your boat, as long as you aren’t demanding that it float my boat too.
I may not understand it, may not get off on it, but I’m not going to tell anyone that they don’t have a right to get off on whatever it is that gets them off, if that makes sense.
Hi Elizebeth
I think that where Fat/Size Acceptance is different from other social/support/activist movements is that historically it has had substantial input from a fetish community in shaping the foundations of the movement.
The changes made in the press releases/communiqués of organizations like NAAFA over the years have shown their change in ideology, but there is still room to distance Fat/Size Acceptance from the fat fetish community.
Fat/Size Acceptance logically has no need for a close association with Fat Fetishes, it is just one of the many activities that members of the Fat/Size community participate in. Fat Acceptance can have its own conversations about dating, attraction and social event without seeking the input of Fat Fetishes.
If you do a google search on “Donna Simpson” and NAAFA you will find many articles and websites with NAAFA’s response. NAAFA’s weak opposition of Fat Fetishes really does not communicate that Fat Acceptance is that much different than Fat Fetishes.
William,
The only comment from the NAAFA I could find was here.
What else do you expect them to say? Feeders are evil and should be banished from the earth?
I don’t think the NAAFA or the Fat Acceptance community need to do anything to distance themselves from fat fetishes. People consider fat admirers (like myself) fat fetishists. We’re not. People assume fat admirers are feeders. We’re not.
And let us not forget that regardless of the fetish, fat people should be a part of Fat Acceptance. Regardless of your private proclivities, you still deserve dignity and respect. You can express your distaste for the practice of intentional weight gain (as opposed to, say, simply engaging in sexual fantasies that revolve around feederism) without trying to portray fat fetishists as freaks we want nothing to do with.
Like Bronwen said, you cannot decry the practice of discrimination and dehumanization if you are participating in the practice yourself.
Peace,
Shannon
Hi Shannon
All I said was that Fat Fetishes need to be clearly defined as being separate from Fat Acceptance. That Fat Acceptance is more important. You are the one that brought up words like evil and having distaste for Fat Fetishes in the conversation.
One test that I often used is to do a google search on “Fat Women and then do another on “fat women” BBW.
The difference in the results is remarkable. Use “Fat Women” “Fat Fetish” and the result is almost as bad.
There needs to be a clear line between Fat Acceptance and Fat Admiration and Fat Fetishes or Fat Acceptance will seem like nothing more than a joke.
William
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